John Robbins on the Weston A. Price Foundation

Mr. Robbins should take time to actually read Dr. Price's work and the work of the Weston Price Foundation.

The statements that he claims are made against vegetarianism are actually statements about veganism. Vegans who avoid all foods that are not of plant origin do not obtain certain vitamins such as B-12 from their food, and therefore must supplement if they are not to suffer from this lack. This makes it clear that humans were not meant to avoid all foods that have this vital vitamin.

It should also be noted that the letter that Dr. Price wrote to his family was written in 1934, after he visited the Swiss, who ate a high-rye and high-dairy, low meat diet, but before he visited some of the African and Inuit populations in 1935 and later, who maintained robust health on very limited carbohydrates and high intake of animal meat and fat and dairy. He discovered that good health could be maintained on these widely varying diets, as long as some source of animal fat and protein was eaten, even if it was insects, and whole, nutrient dense foods grown or raised on rich soil were consumed.

What the Foundation urges is that if you are to consume dairy, it should be raw and from cattle who live and eat on pasture grown in rich organic (no chemicals) soil. If you are to consume meat, it should be from cattle or other animals also raised on their natural diets with access to clean water, fresh air, and sunshine, not kept in close quarters in barns and fed grains and other things that are not their natural foods. If you are consuming marine life, it should be wild and not farmed (when farming means, again, being fed artificial feed made up of foods not natural to the marine life). And that vegetables, grains and fruits be organic and grown in mineral-rich soils.

Dr. Price analyzed and praised the butter from cows raised properly, and said that, given with cod liver oil, it was a miracle food. Since both foods are rich in Vitamin D (a fat-soluble vitamin), and people these days avoid such foods, it's no wonder that they are finally discovering that Vitamin D deficiency is widespread.

Eat what your grandparents ate, or your great-grandparents, before all this processed and fast food started being so widely consumed. Whether you emphasize animal products or more vegetarian selections, you'll be healthier. Don't believe me, you don't know me -- read what the Weston A. Price Foundation website has to say, but more importantly, read Dr. Price's book, Nutrition and Physical Degeneration.

Remember that our government subsidizes both corn and soy, so it's in their interest to get the population to eat as much of that as possible, so they demonize animal foods. Follow the money.

B12 is produced by soil bacteria and is only required in miniscule amounts. Prior to industrial agriculture, it's likely that natural exposure to dirt would give an adequate supply -- that's how gorillas get theirs. Even now, we have B12 producing bacteria in our guts, but in most people they are too low down for the B12 to be absorbed.

Supplementation is wise, vegans suffer no more B-12 deficiency than the general population -- i.e., supplementation is wise regardless of whether or not you consume animal products.

As for vitamin D, you can make your own. Get out in the sunshine. The amount in butter is quite low. If you want to supplement, it's no more artificial to take a D2 suppliment than to eat fish oil if you live inland.

Remember that our government subsidizes both corn and soy, so it's in their interest to get the population to eat as much of that as possible, so they demonize animal foods.

The ignorance here is astounding. The subsidies for corn and soy pale in comparison to those for meat and dairy -- indeed, since most 55-60%of the corn grown goes for animal feed (and a significant bit of the remainder goes for industrial uses), and the vast majority of soy goes for animal feed, corn and soy subsidies are animal agriculture subsidies. Plus animal agriculture benefits from subsidized access to water and pasture, plus subsidized cleanup of pollution from feedlots and slaughterhouses, plus price supports.

And subsidized advertizing. If you want to "follow the money", look at who's underwriting the beef and dairy industries' advertizing. Ever see a "Rice: it's what's for dinner" ad on TV? Or a "Got broccoli?" billboard? But the USDA is all about getting you to consume more meat and dairy. The federal government demonizing animal foods? That's the most ridiculous claim I've read this month.

And it's because of people pushing animal-heavy diets that many vegetarians think they need lots of protein and so heavily consume soy-based meat substitutes. But as there's no need for meat in the diet, there's no need for meat substitutes. you can be a vegetarian or vegan and not eat any soy!

Tom Swiss - proprietor, unreasonable.org

Sunshine:

In the summer, south of atlanta, GA the average caucasian can manufacture a day's worth of D3 via sun exposure by being stripped to the waist for about 30 minutes, during the hours of 11-2.

At lattitudes north of atlanta, GA there is insufficient UV-B present in the atmosphere for people to self-manufacture D3 via sun exposure, in the months from about september to about april (depending on how north one is).

At the extreme north (New york and above), insufficient UV-B is common well through the spring and some days in summer, due to cloud cover.

Additionally, lifestyle matters: many in the north spend most of their days clothed/indoors, with insufficient skin exposed (only the face for example) to manufacture any appreciable D3, even at optimal atmospheric conditions.

Thus, the "flu season", when the immune system is D3 deficient, and when hens slow down laying (calcium processing relies on D3). when the sun picks up, so do we all.

And yet, miraculously, humans have thrived at those lattitudes for thousands of years.

What do inuits eat? Should they plant potatoes in the arctic tundra? Is that a serious suggestion? How do they thrive?

Tom, you said "In the U.S., milk is fortified with vitamin D; dairy products do not naturally contain significant amounts." However, as Dr. Mercola points out, the vitamin D fortified in milk is not Vitamin D3, it's vitamin D2. Studies have proven that "vitamin D2 should no longer be regarded as a nutrient appropriate for supplementation or fortification of foods." That issue aside, the D2 they put in our milk is synthetic, and synthetic vitamins are known to be toxic to humans.
(see: http://content.bandzoogle.com/users/cippianhotmail/files/Dangers_of_Syn…)
(see: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2006/10/26/beware-of…)

In regards to animal feed, the milk we see in most 'normal' grocery stores is produced by cows who are selectively bred to be mutant cows who produce 10-12 times the amount of milk a normal healthy cow does. Not to mention these cows are fed a protein dense soy bean feed (as you pointed out) which further impairs the quality of the milk (did I mention these cows are also constantly getting sick, thus in need of antibiotics, and often produce large discharges of pus into the milk?)
(see: Nourishing Traditions by Sally Fallon)

Your rebuttals further prove the point that the Price foundation is arguing - these products would be far richer in vitamin, mineral, enzyme, and general nutrition content (not to mention the QUALITY of the nutrients would be sufficient for human consumption and produce the positive health effects they have the potential to produce) were they raised and sourced properly. No one can argue too much fat in the diet is bad, but so is too much of anything, especially when it's produced in our current post-industrial agricultural dystopia.

Yes, D2 is synthetic; it's formed by taking ergosterol, a common naturally-occurring compound, and subjecting it to UV, a common naturally-occurring phenomenon. I don't think it's significantly more artificial than fish oil, which -- unless you're living next to a stream and grabbing salmon out of it, and squeezing them yourself -- relies on a heck of a technological infrastructure to create it.

Claims like "synthetic vitamins are known to be toxic to humans" are too general to be meaningful, just non-scientific fear-mongering -- of the sort at which Mercola excels.

D2 is as effective at raising blood levels of the active form of vitamin D as is D3, and from every bit of actual science I've seen seems as safe as D3. Both, of course, are dangerous in high amounts.

None of this changes the facts that dairy products naturally contain little vitamin D, and that the best way to get vitamin D is make it yourself, with a little sunshine.

Tom Swiss - proprietor, unreasonable.org