unreasonable.org

In defence of the Weston A. Price Foundation
I am posting my thoughts on the continual defamation of the foundation set up to honour and continue the work of Weston Andrew Price. One would have thought that the Weston Price Foundation, which is a non-profit organization that promotes healthy food, healthy eating, raw milk and most importantly the health and well being of moo cows and other animals, is surely a good thing and would be embraced wholeheartedly. I would also have thought that vegans, lacto-vegans or whatever ridiculous name you guys call yourselves nowadays, would actually be applauding the Foundation and the work they continue. They stand for such ridiculous policies of hormone free, un-pasteurized milk, grass fed beef. Hence the expression, ‘clean cows clean milk’. I’m not sure if any of the lettuce nibblers on this site are/were aware of the Posilac/rGBH scandal in America. I’m not American I’m Irish so I’m not sure if this shit is still being used in America so perhaps someone can enlighten me on this one. So you guys are happy to slag off the Weston Price Foundation, but have not got the bottle to criticise Monsanto, McDonalds, Burger King and all the other multinational, powerful corporations collectively known as Big Food and Big Chemical? Unbelievable but everything I would expect from people whose main source of meat/protein comes from tofu or soy or some other crap like that. I’m sure my soy munching friends would be delighted to know the facts about their beloved soy. 97% of the world’s soybean crop is genetically modified. This does not mean that it grows faster or produces more soybeans. It simply means that it is resistant to the herbicide sprayed on it. Which means well intentioned but ignorant farmers are free to spray huge amounts of Roundup which contains a substance called glyphosphate. I’m not going to get into the chemical structure of this filth but it’s safe to say this substance will wipe out all and every wildlife it’s sprayed near. Monsanto was the chief supplier to the US government of Agent Orange which was used by the US military to defoliate the rain forest eco-systems of Southeast Asia. Unbeknown to the US military(although I have my doubts) but known to Monsanto was that the Agent Orange contained Dioxin a mortal and toxic poison, one of the most toxic ever created by man.
Bottom line guys is that people will be eating meat for the foreseeable future, me included. In actual fact im going to see is there any juicy steak in the fridge. But I also agree with you guys that animals should be treated with love, care and compassion, which is where the Weston A. Price Foundation comes in. So I suggest that you guys get some meat into you (excuse the pun), and take the fight to the real abusers of the animals you profess to love, i.e. McDonalds, KFC (they’re real bad!), Burger King, Walmart, etc.
All I have heard so far is idiotic treehuggers whingeing about how we shouldn’t eat meat or drink milk, or the ludicrous argument that it is a front for the beef or dairy industry. So you fools should wise up and realize it’s not going to change, like I said the Weston A. Price Foundation is working for the better of animals and animal welfare. So what if some beef barons have jumped on the bandwagon to further there own purposes, at least the animals on their farms have a pretty good standard of living. Would you rather said farmers were injecting their moo cows with steroids, hormones etc and then shipping them off to the MaccieD’s slaughterhouse? Thought not!

If the people who follow WPF & Sally Fallon's diet religiously are healthy, I will take their word for it. I see a contradiction, though, as follows:

Their diet is high in dairy products (good quality, of course). Yet of the many tribes, nations & races that Weston Price himself visited, and who were impressively healthy, the vast majority consumed no dairy products at all. I think there was only one that did, as I remember.

So, it seems to me that they are being dishonest in saying that their dietary philosophy is based on the work of Weston Price.

I have a 71-year-old (very frail) sister who has been following the Weston A. Price Org eating regimen for 9 months and she is now suffereing from cryptosporiosis, to a near life-threatening degree because of the severe dehydration and possible resulting kidney disease. I believe the parasite's origin is in the raw milk, which can never be completely free of bacteria, protazoa, parasites, and whatever else may affect us adversely. She is, however, adamant that pasteurizing milk kills ALL nutrients so she will not listen to my (or anyone else's) opinion. Only under her strong protest did we get her to see a doctor and take medication to attack her illness. I will not be surprised if this diet kills her.

I find it funny how soy shills/propagandists never explain the difference between fermented soy and unfermented soy. Asians have been consuming fermented soy for years, and even that is done in moderation.

I am so sick of you soy shills/propagandists encouraging people to overconsume soy products, and I am so sick of you smearing people as "meat/dairy industry shills" when they attack any form of soy at all, including GMO soy. So take your Monsanto dirty money and choke on it.

The soy industry, soy shills/propagandists, CSPI, PETA, National Action Against Obesity, Monsanto, and the Center for Consumer Freedom. ALL Rockefeller fronts.

I just attended the Weston A Price foundation conference in San Francisco last weekend and would like to contribute to this conversation on the basis of what I learned there. I attended a 5 hour talk by Sally Fallon there.

1. This thread complains extensively about the emphasis on milk products but I think the characterization of WAP as being so focused on milk is unfair. Yes, milk is a big part of the agenda. They support this by showing evidence of the health benefits of raw milk from grass fed freely pastured animals. That said, milk is just one small part of the total agenda. In Sally's 5-hour overview, she spent relatively little time talking about milk. It was just one of many topics that were explored.

2. At the conference there were a lot of speakers and some were more knowledgeable than others. Sally Fallon was the most amazing. Very articulate and educated. I was comfortable with her and had confidence in what she was saying. I have a fairly good gut instinct for separating quacks from real teachers, and I definitely do not believe Sally is a quack. I found her to be very credible.

3. I do agree that the overall recommendations of WAP are focused more on what might appeal to the American audience and they don't necessarily have a 360 degree view. In other words, a lot of the material and research fails to comprehensively explore diets of other regions, particularly, Asia. That is an area for further development. But, just because they haven't fully explored Asian (or other) diets does not mean the advice is bad. To the contrary, I still believe everything I learned at the conference from Sally to be sound. There is room to improve by integrating a more global perspective.

4. There was detailed discussion about the difference between Asian use of Soy and American use of manufactured chemical-based soy products and the difference between fermented and non-fermented soy. There was NOT a wholesale dismissal of soy, we had a nuanced and thoughtful discussion of soy and Sally specifically recommended traditional Asian forms of soy like Tempeh and Natto and Miso, she was counseling us to avoid heavily processed artificial soy products that are de-natured and full of toxic chemicals. These products don't exist in the traditional Asian diet.

I have just dared quackbusters to give me one objective way they decide what is mainstream and what is peripheral. As a research scientist myself for 40 years outside the university labs, I find them biased, self-centered, self-laudatory, and often about 15-20 years behind independent science. Regarding WAP, I have yet to find a paragraph they have written that I can reject. On the other hand, the frequent drugging of children is so low that months of reading about Stalin and Hitler has yet to turn up an instance of them drugging children for "mental illness," such as ADD and juvenile bipolar disorder that were unknown before 1960. I will debate before an audience any professional who claims that the mainstream is a 40-fold increase in bipolar disorder in a decade among tiny children, and millions who may be budding geniuses called hyperactive (compared to what?!). 'Nuf said

They run their mouths like they're the kings of the world, but when you call them out on their BS and show them documented FACTS, they cower and call you a shill. Quackbusters is a front for Big Pharma and the FDA. Stephen Barrett is a government shill.

"WAPF simply denies that such a link exists, sort of like how tobacco companies simply denied the link between smoking and lung cancer."

Uh, no, actually that's a good analogy for what you do in your post, denying the excellent deconstructions provided by Enig and Fallon of highly publicized original research (perhaps simply ignorance in the case of your post, blathering from your apriorisms instead of actually checking it out). Enig particularly, also Fallon, does an excellent job of reporting on the statistical and methodological flaws and biases in original research - not to mention some laughably ridiculous "conclusions" drawn that contradict the papers' own data.

By the way, the vegsource.com articles are pure crap, barely literate FUD. The energygrid one is better. I disagree with the arguments, but at least the author attempted some logical points.

I find it funny how soy shills/propagandists never explain the difference between fermented soy and unfermented soy. Asians have been consuming fermented soy for years, and even that is done in moderation.

This is a good example of the disinformation about soy. The truth is that tofu (unfermented soy) is consumed at levels in china, taiwan and japan roughly equal to the same amount we in the west consume bread. somewhere in the neighborhood of 70 pounds a year per person. This is not including the massive amount of soy milk consumed from some 38,000 tofu shops in Japan. the population in japan has 15 times the number of people over 100 than we do in the west. that alone is quite a dietary study. The people in Japan that consume the most unfermented soy are the people of Okinawa. They eat tofu every day. Okinawa boasts the longest lived population on earth. They have 50 times the people over 100 than we in the US do.

some other actual facts (instead of Weston A. Price Foundation lies) about un fermented soy are:

no studies not one ever have reliably demonstrated an increase in the risk of breast cancer among human women eating soy. There are however reliable studes that have reported a decrease in the risk of breast cancer among human women eating soy compared to women who did not eat soy.

Animals that were given soy phytoestrogens developed fewer mammary (breast) tumors in many studies.

Phytoestrogens are actively being researched by the medical community for beneficial effects on cardiovascular and bone health. Studies are also examining various phytoestrogens for relieving some of the symptoms associated with menopause.

all of the above facts are actually the opposite of the false propaganda put out by the anti soy people and make the anti soy people seem quite evil and point to questionable motives and a desire to do people harm with false information.

Veganism is a philosophy of compassion. Eating dead animals and their secretions contributes to the enslavement and death of many sentient beings. A whole foods vegan diet is the healthieset diet on the planet according to "THe China Study", by Dr. Colin campbell. Read "The World Peace Diet " by Dr. Will Tuttle. May all beings be happy and free from suffering.

To me the type of diet that the Price foundation advocates makes sense. A traditional diet that has been consumed for millenia. In the bible the Promised Land is the "land of milk and honey." I am not able to get raw milk where I live but I certainly would drink it if I could. But with all due respect to Dr. Enig and Sally Fallon, I don't believe they have really made the case with the necessary scientific rigor. I believe they are right but I myself would not be convinced by their writings and I don't expect other people to be. The best case for rejecting the lipid hypothesis--the theory that it is saturated fat and cholesterol that is responsible for heart disease and obesity--was made in the recent book "Good calories, Bad Calories," by Gary Taubes. To say it makes for dry reading is probably an understatement but I found it really gripping because it tears apart the reigning nutritional orthodoxy with such meticulous care. Taubes is a writer for Science Magazine and he has really done his homework. His book more than any other I've read (and I've read books like "The China Study" as well) convinced me beyond the shadow of a doubt that the healthiest diets are traditional diets that include mostly, if not all, whole foods. And meat is not the villain! It is possible to eat more or less meat and either way be eating a very healthy diet--but I think completely abstaining from meat is probably not wise. To me his book and Sally's writings have been have taken the scales from my eyes and let me see what is obvious if people would look with an open mind and not get caught up in fad science. Why would people think that skim milk is healthy but whole milk isn't? Why would one integral component of milk--the protein--be healthy and the other--the fat--not be? Why would meat and saturated fat be unhealthy when cultures such as the Inuit eat these virtually exclusively and thrived until our "civilized" processed foods penetrated their lives?

The McGovern Committee hearings on diet and Ancel Keys put America through a great social experiment. Fats are bad - Carbs are good. Viz. the American Food Pyramid.
The results: after 40 years of lowfat this and lowfat that we have an out of control obesity and diabetes and cardiac epidemic that is driving our health care costs through the roof.

If we had listened to Weston Price and Robert Atkins we would be living longer and healthier lives and our medical costs would be going down.
You can't argue with vegans who have scruples about killing other living beings but they should realize their health is being compromised. Along with people who eat unfermented soy.
You can't argue with the boys who run this post. Their minds are made up and facts will only enrage them. "Peace" indeed!!!!